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of no-self." That is exactly nearer to the reality than realization of the self -- realization of no-self, an enlightening of no-darkness, because when the realization comes, there is no self. So Buddha says that no self is the reality. That could not be understood; it is very difficult. He said: existence of no self, anatman. There is no atman, there is anatman. And he meant something, something meaningful. But he could not be understood. We can understand atman because it approximates the ego. We can think about the self because it is something like an extended ego, a bigger ego.... So we can conceive of it....
THIRD QUESTIONER: BUDDHA SAYS "NO ATMAN"...
A: Buddha says no atman.
THIRD QUESTIONER: MAHAVIRA SAYS THERE IS ATMAN.
A: Mahavira says there is atman, but without the ego: there is no ego -- atman is. Buddha says there is no atman. And the reality is they mean the same thing.
But I say, Buddha's expression more approximates the reality, yet Mahavira's expression is more likely to be understood by all. The expression is different; but they mean the same thing. Mahavira says, there is self but no ego: When you realize the no-ego, you will know the self. Buddha says, there is no self. When you realize this, you will know existence, you will know the being, you will come to know.... And if you ask Buddha what we will come to know, what will be realized, he'd say, realize and know, because when you ask what, you have again asked a dualistic question. You are again asking aware of what? So Buddha says come to awareness, and then you will know there is awareness but you will not know anything about it.
That awareness is freedom.
THIRD QUESTIONER: UP TILL NOW WE HAVE HEARD YOU ON MAHAVIRA AND BUDDHA, OR ON THE ATMAN. CAN YOU ENLIGHTEN US ABOUT CHRIST'S OF THE ATMAN? HAS HE GIVEN ANY LIGHT ON THIS?
A: Not in such a way as to be compared with Buddha or Mahavira. Jesus speaks a totally different language. Jesus' language is totally different, he talks about the Kingdom of God.
THIRD QUESTIONER: HE ALSO CAME TO A STATE OF ENLIGHTENMENT HIMSELF?
A: He came, he came... he understands. He realized what
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